oldrocker
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Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Sept 17, 2022 14:41:17 GMT
Thanks philbadfactor it's very much appreciated and hopefully the tribunal will see what's going on with me and my disability but I have this gut feeling they won't, anyway i'll keep you all updated as to what happens.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Sept 30, 2022 13:33:54 GMT
Hi Everyone, Well it's been an interesting couple of weeks as I had an email from the Jobcentre and I have spoken twice so far to my work coach/mentor type person from Fedcap, 1st off the email from the Jobcentre said that if I don't agree to my commitments then my UC claim will be broken, the commitments I had to agree to were, 1st go onto the Surestart scheme run by FEDCAP, which I am now as of last week,
2nd that I will spend at least 35 hours a week applying for jobs and going to interviews, and any training courses the Jobcentre think will help me get back into work ASAP,
I worked it out that if I applied for one job every 15 minutes it works out to be 140 jobs a week, the 35 hours a week works out to be roughly 7 hours a day looking for work, now granted it doesn't state how many jobs I'm suppose to apply for each day but I'm guessing it will be quit high, but I will know for certain when I speak to my work coach next week,
What annoyed me was after I agreed to the commitments the last page said that if you don't agree with the commitments then you can leave a message on your journal for your work coach to get in touch so you can discuss it in more detail, if I had known that I would have done that first then agreed afterwards because I don't agree with the amount of hours I am expected to look for work personally I think it's unrealistic of them to expect that as my condition can leave me bedridden for days sometimes, and not able to go near my computer which is in my front room and I don't have a mobile phone anymore,
Anyway back to what happened with FEDCAP, so last week I had a conversation over the phone that took an hour and a half to do, now originally they weren't going to do the introduction over the phone because the Jobcentre had failed to inform them of my mobility issues, so they said I had to go into the offices in Oxford now I told him I couldn't do that because of I have difficulty getting around, he then said let me chat with my manager so he was gone about ten minutes and when he came back he asked me if I had a vailed sicknote, I said yes and he said okay we can do the introduction over the phone which we did,
I had to answer some questions about my health my work history my lifestyle whether I had ever been convicted of a crime was my name on the sex offenders register things like that, then I had to fill in the background about my disability as the Jobcentre never told them anything about it only that I am fit to work,
After I explained how my condition affects my day to day life the guy then said to me, I don't think we will be able to help you as you are a unique case but we still have to go through the scheme with you because the Jobcentre have told us to, he then said that although being on the scheme was mandatory the services they offer are voluntary and I don't have to accept any off them, he basically said I can refuse to do anything they offer me and I'm on this scheme for 12 months, Anyway I spoke to him this week and he said that he will send me through some vids to watch on things like how to improve my C.V to get the interview I want, how to improve my interview skills and how to be more efficient at job searching, then the next thing he said made me question the whole sanity of the system,
He said that they can't really help me find work because of the sicknote as I am medically classed as unfit to find work and as long as I keep putting in new sicknotes there is nothing they can do for me I then explained that until my tribunal hearing I have to keep putting in these sicknotes and the hearing could be months away, he said I know and it's pointless you being on the scheme at the moment but we have to go through the motions of you doing the scheme just to keep the Jobcentre happy, I genuinely have no words to describe the stupidity of the system, anyway I have another phone call with him next week then the week after that they expect me to go into the offices, then I will only hear from him by phone every two weeks until the 12 months is up,
Anyway that's where I am at the moment with everything to do with me and the Jobcentre and I still don't have a date for the tribunal hearing.
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Post by gordo on Sept 30, 2022 22:07:00 GMT
Hi oldrocker. Sorrry to hear 'bout all this insane hassle! Sounds like Jobcenter dudes are being petty, and following the "ids" way of doing things right down to the very last detail. It is simply impossible for anyone to even try 35 Hrs of jobsearching!
They really should be taking into account your various ailments, and making allowances for that.
Is there any local MP you could write to? I know there is at least one Labour MP in Oxford. Might not be the actual constituency MP, but they perhaps might be able to give some kind of advice. Guess you got nothing to lose with that one. Anyhow, hope it goes ok for you.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Oct 1, 2022 0:12:58 GMT
Hi Gordo and I agree with you that the Jobsworth at my local centre are certainly being petty minded but of course this could all be for nothing if the tribunal rules in my favour,
And I'm actually in West Oxfordshire and I know my local MP is a conservative and not very useful at all as I have written to him in the past and he replied with sorry unable to help you with your situation,
Even when our old conservative MP was prime minster he couldn't help me with a different problem that me and the family were facing, he explained to me that in reality an MP can do very little for members of their constituency as their power to interfere with organisations or change a councils decisions or interfere with other government bodies decisions is not possible unless it benefits the wider community, so of course my situation wouldn't benefit the wider community mate,
Anyway I will update in a few weeks after I've spoken to my work coach again and I may write to my MP just not sure at the moment though.
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Post by philbadfactor on Oct 1, 2022 17:26:32 GMT
That all sounds spookily reminiscent of the Tony Blair system. I was on ordinary Unemployment benefit back then before switching to Health related benefits when Gordon Brown came in or it might have been a bit before then. I had to attend every day at this weird organisation and eventually went to a Voluntary Organisation. There I met a guy who said forced Voluntary work was a contradiction and they wouldn't force me to do anything. Here's a list of Charity Shops if you want to contact them. To get my benefits I had to pitch up there once a week to get my timesheet signed which was then sent to the jobcentre. Just after all that many were allowed onto health benefits as the concept of treated as "unemployable" came in. On the letters it simply read "treated as unable to work". In other words a clear acknowledgement that employers would not employ long term unemployed people. The scum who came in turned that on it's head stating that many were on health benefits that should not have been. And introduced the idea of "languishing" and "malingering". Then little britain tv show started doing a skit whereby a man in a wheelchair jumped out of it and did cartwheels when no one was looking. Shameless was another tv show and the idea of the welfare scrounger caught on. and it's been like that ever since.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Oct 2, 2022 8:12:55 GMT
Many years ago when I was first on unemployment benefit before it became known as JSA, the jobcentre told me that so long as I applied for a couple of jobs a week then that was fine, so I did and I managed to get myself a job on a local dairy farm which I worked at for years until the farmer sold up and retired, so after that I decided to joined the fire service and did that for nearly ten years but I became medically unfit due to an old back injury from my time on the dairy farm it was getting worse and worse each year to the point I was in a lot of pain so I had to resign from the fire service but gotta give them created they tried for two years working with me to find a way for me to stay as an active front line firefighter but we had to admit defeat in the end,
So I had to go back on the dole, but by this time it was called job seekers allowance or JSA for short and things were very different I had to keep a physical diary I had to show evidence that I really had applied for the job in my diary, if after 2 weeks I hadn't heard back I had to chase the company up and find out why, if I didn't get the job after the interview I then had to ask for a written explanation so I could improve on my interview technique so not getting the job didn't happen in the future,
And a lot of the new things were brought in after those two shows had started and on a personal note I was never a fan of them especially Shameless just didn't find it funny in the least, anyway this new scheme I'm on if I miss one day or don't engage with it then I'm marked down as none compliant and will lose my UC claim and therefore any benefits I maybe entitled to, also the guy at FEDCAP explained that this scheme is a government idea to get people back into work who were affected by the pandemic he also stated the scheme so far has had a 95% success rate of getting people back into work so he expects I'll find a job easy enough as well,
But I was never affected by the pandemic because my last job which was a tractor driver for an arable farmer ended naturally as it was only a summer job back in 2017 a few years before the pandemic struck, but I guess they will use any scheme to get people working again, and yes tractor driving can be a physically demanding job but at the time it was less of a strain on my back than the fire service had been, but nowadays I couldn't do either as my back pain is permanently there and it radiates down my legs with my left foot being permanently numb which the consultant at my local orthopedic hospital said that's how it will be for the rest of my life, the back legs and foot being in constant numbness and pain.
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Post by gordo on Oct 2, 2022 9:18:16 GMT
Hi oldrocker. It's a pity the F.D. couldn't have found a support staff role for you. But things like cleaning and portering, etc, can also be rather physically demanding. Desk roles (within the ranks) tend to go to Station Officer ranks and above. And some of those positions depend on the type and size and locality of larger stations, and larger mainly urban Fire Departments.
As for the new(ish) jobhunting schemes on offer, much of this was dreamt up by the appalling "ids". He who invented an extra (i) for "Iain", as it was just plain "Ian" which clearly wasn't posh enough for him, and then he added the "Duncan" to make his name sound better, tho I've never considered Duncan to be particularly posh sounding! But George Ian Smith obviously thought his new fancy invented name was better sounding than plain "GIS" !! Now had a dude on JSA or Universal Credits invented even half the stuff this political idiot did, with his barefaced lies about the local college he went to for a bit in Italy which wasn't the famous ancient University he said it was, but just a nearby college, etc, etc, that jobseeker could find their money stopped under the very rules he put thru!
I don't believe that new scheme has a 95% success rate. That simply is not credible. It's no more believable than Russia claims over Ukraine territory!
These folks don't live in reality, in their safe political positions, or cushy jobs in London and the likes. The older idea where folks had to chase up employers was also equally ludicrous, as most employers just would not respond. They had better things to do, and employers in fact, were getting rather annoyed at being snowed under with applications from folks totally unsuitable for the positions on offer, and then folks wanting to know why they never got an interview, or why they failed. Clearly the Govt. Ministers didn't reckon the burden, (and how infuriating) that was with the bosses!
It has to said, alas, some of these ideas came in under Labour. Gordon Brown as Prime Minister made them worse, and the tories being tories, took these various rules as far as they could. One change Gordon Brown made has caused immense harm to older ppl, back then and now. When a person who was on JSA got to age 60, they automatically went onto Pension Credits, as it was clear, most employers wouldn't want those in that age group especially if already out of work. However, if a person went onto benefits after 60, they didn't get that option. However, Gordon Brown's Administration changed all that. He raised the age to 65. Which meant we had, (and still have) folks in their early to mid 60s being spoken down to outrageously sometimes depending on the DWP staffer, young enough to be their grandkids demanding what they've been doing to look for work! Labour also brought in the present system of Work Capability Tests. Which as we know, the tories made that worse, too. Things like this turned many a would be Labour voter off voting Labour in 2010 They didn't see the point of voting for a Party that betrayed them so badly. Rachel Reeves claiming during that 2010 General Election Labour would be tougher on the unemployed than Thatcher, did nothing to help either, but turn even more voters away. But they weren't expecting the evil "ids" to come along, and make things yet worse still all around!
So we are in this situation we find ourselves today. It is an unfortunate one at that. Guess we can only hope for better in the future.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Oct 10, 2022 10:00:57 GMT
Hi everyone just a quick update as I have now spoken to my work coach and the guy from FEDCAP, and basically my work coach said that at the moment I don't have to look for work as I on the Restart Scheme with FEDCAP, I just have to follow the advice from them for the duration of the scheme,
And the guy from FEDCAP confirmed during our phone call last week that until I get the decision from the tribunal that I don't have to do anything they send my way unless I want to, he said the only thing they can do for me is get me prepared to look for work just in case the tribunal hearing doesn't rule in my favour, it's so I'm able to jump straight into job searching as I'd have covered all the other parts already, Anyway that's where I'm at with the Jobcentre and FEDCAP,
Also on a personal note my mother-in-law died on Saturday which was a shock as it was sudden and unexpected so me and the wife have been left to deal with all that as her older siblings don't want to get involved they just want to come to the funeral.
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Post by gordo on Oct 10, 2022 12:17:00 GMT
Hi oldrocker. Hope the DWP stuff goes okay for you. Sorry to hear to hear about your mother in law.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Oct 10, 2022 15:43:39 GMT
Hi gordo, Thanks it's very much appreciated, and yes hopefully the DWP stuff goes okay for me.
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Post by philbadfactor on Oct 11, 2022 8:24:06 GMT
Hi oldrocker, glad things aren't too bad and they're not stressing you too much anyway and also sorry to hear about your loss as well. If you were 10 years in the Fire Service, that in itself could count for a lot on your CV. It proves you are no slouch for a kick off. I have an acquaintance who has been trying for years to get into that job. As I understand it it's highly competitive and hard to get into. He fails the exams each time but only just. So he tries again and same result. I think it's the multiple choice decision making bit that catches him out, but I know you need good Maths and English as well. He's given up now as he's too unwell.
On a brighter note I have been awarded PIP ! I didn't even need an interview they just gave it to me. In a way I'm kicking myself for not applying years ago, as if I qualify now 5 years ago I most certainly would have done.
So my advice now re; claiming is ask for more help from socila services and professional organisations and have them fill in the forms on your behalf. I got help from The Peabody Trust and they have succeeded on my behalf.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Oct 14, 2022 10:26:37 GMT
Hi philbadfactor thank you it's very much appreciated mate,
Anyway as for the fire service I joined before they changed the recruitment process so didn't sit and take any of the tests modern firefighters take these days mate, they came in a few years after I had joined so I only had to answer a few math's and english question and do a fitness test and once I passed all that my training could begin,
But I understand they can be very difficult to pass and I know that in the past some people have used the retained firefighter route to become a wholetime firefighter, because at one time it was easier to become a retained firefighter than wholetime, you could then use your retained experience as a stepping stone to wholetime but I understand it's the same recruitment process for joining either one now, so your friend may not be any better off trying to go through a retained station but there is plenty of help and advice online with how to pass the recruitment process and depending on his condition he may still be able to join,
And glad to hear you have been awarded PIP and they did that with me when I first applied for it they just awarded me it, but apparently that's what they normally they just award it the first time and then do the interviews and assessments from the second award onwards mate that's what I got told,
I have Citizens Advice helping me with my tribunal but my PIP claim I had to do myself, hopefully they will award it again but I got told recently that this government are trying to cut back on the amount of people being awarded PIP so we shall see what happens I guess,
Also had another chat with someone from that Restart Scheme at FEDCAP yesterday and she also confirmed that everything they send me is optional and I don't have to do any of it at all, she also told me that a tribunal date at the moment takes six months to come through so I'm on this course for at least that length of time I guess.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Oct 17, 2022 10:45:35 GMT
Hi Everyone,
Well I've just had a run in with my work coach as they are now saying that I have to go into the FEDCAP offices instead of doing everything over the phone as was originally agreed by my work coach and the FEDCAP people, so I told him I'm not going in and he said that's fine we will do the thing we gotta do on our side,
So I'm guessing they are going to sanction me and reduce my UC money again the last time that happened to me was about 20+ years ago when I was on unemployment allowance and it only lasted for about 3 months before it went back to the full amount and they use to have an emergency fund you could claim so your money doesn't drop to low and cause you to become homeless not sure that is still available will have to find out,
Anyway I will wait for certain as to what they will do but that's the usual route they go down threatening claimants with sanctions until you do what they want you to do, which is basically a form of bullying but because it's the jobcentre they can get away with it.
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Post by gordo on Oct 17, 2022 16:01:07 GMT
Hi oldrocker. If they had made an agreement that stuff can be done over the phone, then why have they suddenly changed that? I'd see about making a formal complaint against them, as that is not acceptable. And if they were to dare sanction you, definitely appeal against it.
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oldrocker
Junior Member
Hope springs eternal Baldrick
Posts: 79
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Post by oldrocker on Oct 19, 2022 15:07:08 GMT
Hi Everyone,
Wanted to wait until I'd had my phone appointment with Citizens Advice about writing my statement for my tribunal hearing which has now been done and sent off the guy at Citizens Advice didn't say if I had a strong case or not it's just a waiting game now, however he was shocked that I had scored zero points on every single assessment and that it states I can walk 50 meters continuously by stopping and resting for a few minutes then walk another 50 meters and so on like that,
He explained to me the 50 meters is the length of 5 double-decker buses and I explained to him I can barely make it past ten feet without having to stop for a rest so all this was put into the statement along with me getting flustered and anxious about traveling to unfamiliar places and how I need my wife with me to help and reassure me that we are going in the right direction and to look out for things like road signs and place names,
At the end of the conversation I explained about what happened with me and my work coach earlier this week, and he said yes you can definitely appeal a sanction if that's what they and he said I need to run through your statement with my supervisor just to see if we need to add anything, he then said out of curiosity who is your work coach and I told him and he said ah yes we know exactly who you are talking about, anyway he said I'll phone you back in a few minutes which he did,
He said that his supervisor just added one more bit to the section about how going back to work would have a long term affect on my health and wellbeing, he then said something I wasn't expecting and that was he had spoken to the jobcentre manager at my local centre and she said they have no problem with me doing everything over the phone with FEDCAP and I'm definitely not being sanctioned she was puzzled why I would think that, she then expained that it's actually FEDCAP saying I need to go in for an appointment but as far as the jobcentre are concerned I don't have to I can still do everything via the phone,
The only other thing she didn't know was that I had gone for a tribunal hearing and was surprised that I had even been put on the scheme but sounds like the right hand not knowing what the left hand is doing,
He also said about my PIP claim and said that once I get the decision back that I'm to contact them so they can help me with my mandatory reconsideration because I should be getting the mobility element and not just the daily living allowance, Anyway that's where I'm upto with the tribunal hearing and the situation with the jobcentre so it's a case of wait n see I guess.
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